John Perkins: How economic hitmen perpetuate imperialism globally (ep244)
John Perkins (@jperkinsauthor) was a former chief economist at a major consulting firm, where he advised the World Bank, United Nations, Fortune 500 corporations, and the U.S. and other governments—though much of this was a part of his previous work as an economic hit man he later denounced and became a whistleblower on, as he detailed in his New York Times Bestselling memoir, Confessions Of An Economic Hit Man. His latest book is Touching the Jaguar.
(We're running a giveaway of Touching the Jaguar on Patreon!)
In this episode, John sheds light on what his work as an economic hit man entailed and how economic hitmen, to this day, perpetuate modern-day imperialism and colonialism; how we can transform our current death economy into a life economy, and what that might look like; and more.
To start, get a glimpse below into the conversation between John and Green Dreamer Podcast's host, Kamea Chayne.
Musical feature: Trust The Sun by The Fruitful Darkness by Trevor Hall (@TrevorHallMusic)
“I began to see that these statistics, such as GDP, were skewed totally in favor of the wealthy, and that this whole process is aimed at helping our corporations and helping us put these countries in debt and at our mercy.”
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This is a conversation on Green Dreamer with Kamea Chayne, a podcast and multimedia journal illuminating our paths towards ecological regeneration, intersectional sustainability, and true abundance and wellness for all. This preview has been edited for clarity. Subscribe to Green Dreamer Podcast on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or any podcast app to stay informed and updated on our latest episodes!
On modern-day imperialism through economic hitmen:
"I became an economist with a major consulting firm and very quickly rose to the chief economist. But what I really was was an economic hit man. My job—and I had a decent size staff of three of four dozen people as well—was to identify countries with resources our corporations covet, like oil, and then arrange a huge loan to that country from the World Bank or one of its sisters.
But the money didn't go to the country; it went to our own corporations to build big infrastructure projects in that country. It went to our engineering and equipment manufacturing companies to build power plants, highways, and industrial parks, and other things that helped a few rich families that owned the industries, the banks, and the shopping malls—they benefited from the electricity and so forth.
And this helped the economy ‘grow’, because these people really represent the statistics of the economy—the GDP. I'd been trained to believe that if you invest this kind of money into the countries, you help everybody. I believed that for a while.
But over time, I began to see that the statistics were very skewed. The GDP really represents a few wealthy people more than anybody else. While the wealthy people were getting wealthier and doing well and the GDP statistically was showing growth, the majority of the people were suffering.
Money was diverted from health, education, and other social services to pay off the interest on the debt. In the end, the debt couldn't be repaid, so we economic hitmen would go back in, usually with the guys from the International Monetary Fund, and restructure the debt under certain conditions.
For example, the country would have to sell its resource, such as oil, really cheap without any social or environmental regulations, or sell off their major public sector businesses like water, sewage system, electrical utilities, schools, and so on to our investors at cut-rate prices.
Over time, I began to see that this system wasn't working. It was very skewed in favor of the wealthy. So I did this for ten years and then I finally got out."
On the unspoken consequences of rejecting U.S. intervention:
"I want to explain that the leaders of these countries know that if we economic hit men failed or if they don't buy into the system we're advocating, they're likely to get overthrown in coups or assassinated by people we call ‘the jackals’. The United States has admitted that we played a huge role in the overthrowing and assassination of Salvador Allende of Chile—he was overthrown by a CIA-fostered coup, as was Jacobo Árbenz of Guatemala, Patrice Lumumba of Congo, Ngô Dình Diêm of Vietnam, Mosaddeq of Iran… The list goes on and on.
Leaders of these countries are very incentivized to take on these debts and loans—basically these slave chains of debt—because first of all, they and their cronies are going to do well off of this, and second, if they don't do it, they'll probably be pushed out.
I had two clients, President of Ecuador, Jaime Roldós, and the Head of State of Panama, Omar Torrijos, who refused to play this game and they both died in very very suspicious private plane crashes within three months of each other."
On how corporations have become more powerful than governments:
"Corporations are more powerful than any government. In fact, the definition of capitalism basically is that the means of production and sales are not controlled by governments; they're owned by private individuals, and you have lots of competition. Those are the two basics.
Well, our means of production are not controlled by governments for the most part—they're controlled by individuals. But what has happened now is that it has been turned on its head, and now these individuals [can control] governments.
We know in the United States, we don't really have much of a democracy here. Nobody can get elected without huge financial support from big corporations or their primary stockholders. They control these politicians to a very high degree.
And we no longer have a very competitive economy. There are parts of the economy that are competitive, but for the most part, it's an oligarchy. It's a monopolistic oligarchic economy where big corporations push the little guys out of business, time and time again. So we don't have a true form of capitalism; we have something a lot of economists, including me, call a predatory form of capitalism."
Final words of wisdom:
"Keep dreaming green, and keep changing the perception so that we create a greener perception, and out of that, we create a much greener reality.
Keep up the great work, everyone, and thanks for being part of this.”
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